How To Turn A One Person Business Into Several Businesses
Introduction:
In this episode of Talking Hospitality, hosts Timothy R. Andrews and Tracey Rashid engage in a captivating conversation with Nick Clover, a seasoned entrepreneur in the hospitality sector. The episode delves into Nick's journey from starting as a 14-year-old working in a pub to establishing several successful companies in the hospitality industry.
Why Listen to This Episode:
This episode is a treasure trove of insights for hospitality professionals, especially those in leadership roles or aspiring to be. Nick Clover's story is not just about business success; it's a narrative of resilience, innovation, and a deep understanding of the hospitality industry. Listeners will gain valuable lessons on career development, the importance of people in the industry, and how to navigate the challenges and opportunities in hospitality.
Key Points of Interest:
- Early Beginnings: Nick's journey in hospitality began at 14, working in a pub, which instilled in him the value of hard work and the importance of starting from the ground up.
- Building a Business: The episode explores how Nick transitioned from working in various hospitality roles to starting his own businesses, highlighting the challenges and triumphs of entrepreneurship.
- Importance of People: A recurring theme is the significance of people in the hospitality industry, both as employees and customers, and how nurturing these relationships is crucial for business success.
- Overcoming Adversity: Nick shares his experiences during the recession, offering insights into resilience and the importance of adapting to changing circumstances.
- Industry Challenges: The discussion touches on issues like burnout, drug and alcohol problems in the industry, and how to address these challenges responsibly.
- Empowering the Next Generation: The episode emphasizes the importance of mentorship, training, and development in the hospitality industry, showcasing Nick's commitment to nurturing new talent.
- Leadership Insights: Nick provides valuable advice on leadership, stressing the balance between confidence and humility, and the importance of being authentic and approachable.
Conclusion:
This episode of Talking Hospitality is a must-listen for anyone in the hospitality industry seeking inspiration and practical advice. Nick Clover's journey and insights offer a unique perspective on building a successful career and business in hospitality, making it an invaluable resource for seasoned professionals and newcomers alike.
Summary
In this episode, Nick Clover shares his journey in the hospitality industry and how he built successful businesses like Appetite4Work and HJUK. He emphasizes the importance of onboarding and support in the industry and encourages more people to join. Nick also discusses the challenges and misconceptions in the industry and the impact of the Opra Awards. He shares his philosophy and principles in building businesses and offers advice for aspiring leaders. The episode concludes with a rapid-fire question round.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction
02:07 Nick's Journey in Hospitality
05:18 Starting Appetite for Work
06:16 Importance of Onboarding and Support
07:10 Passion for the Hospitality Industry
08:09 Encouraging People to Join the Industry
10:06 Challenges and Misconceptions in the Industry
12:40 The Opra Awards
15:39 Philosophy and Principles in Building Businesses
17:35 Building HJUK and Otolo
20:00 Staying Focused and Motivated
23:38 Advice for Aspiring Leaders
28:34 Rapid Fire Questions
31:09 Conclusion
Transcript
Welcome to another episode of Talking
Hospitality.
2
:I'm Timothy R Andrews and I'm joined today
with my co-host Tracy Rashid.
3
:Today we ask the question, how can you
build a business from being a one person
4
:band to several successful companies?
5
:Our guest today, Nick Clover, shares his
story of why he started, the highs and
6
:lows of his journey and what the future
holds now 21 years later.
7
:We're excited to bring you today's episode
with the support of our esteemed brand
8
:partners, Graphic Kitchen.
9
:Graphic Kitchen stands at the forefront of
innovative design solutions, transforming
10
:spaces into vibrant, engaging
environments.
11
:They specialize in spoke graphic designs
that breathe life into any setting.
12
:Whether it's a bustling restaurant or a
chic hotel lounge,
13
:and memorable experience.
14
:Discover their stunning portfolio and how
they can elevate your space at grap
15
:Welcome back everybody.
16
:Thanks for joining us again.
17
:But today we're diving into the world of
hospitality with a very special guest,
18
:Nick Clover, the visionary behind Tolo,
Appetite for Work and HJUK.
19
:Nick, it's a pleasure to have you with us
and welcome to the show.
20
:So Nick, you have built an impressive
portfolio with a total of only a prototype
21
:for work and HJUK.
22
:So let's start from the beginning.
23
:And please let us know what those
businesses are and what they're all about.
24
:But also how did your journey in
hospitality begin?
25
:So, 14 years old, working in a pub.
26
:Joined some cash.
27
:Remember the time, planning to go into
Glastonbury the following year.
28
:So, um, pocket money is always helpful,
right?
29
:And for the, so I started working in a
pub.
30
:Loved it.
31
:Hard work.
32
:local pub had a successful busy kitchen,
so the pans are coming thick and fast and
33
:they're going to keep up.
34
:Some of my fondest memories were working
in that pub with the people I worked with
35
:as the young kid who just did it best.
36
:Will Barron Why didn't you at the X14, I
know, wanted to be a pot wash?
37
:Richard Larkin Well, if I didn't wash
pots, I wouldn't have had any money.
38
:Well, to go to Glastonbury, also to, you
know, sort of 14 years old, to be able to
39
:go and see friends, for example, basically
it was a good lesson in life.
40
:Will Barron Said to work, work for cash.
41
:My older brother works in hospitality as
well.
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:Big inspiration.
43
:Don't know at the time if there was any
association there, it was more just a case
44
:of, I might've been the first to actually
work in hospitality.
45
:And I think he had worked in another pub
for a friend of the family doing similar
46
:thing, but watch, it looks fun, it suits.
47
:How did you go from a 14-year-old to a
flat for work, HGK and a toilet?
48
:I got experience in the kitchen, got
experience in the front of Paris, got
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:experience in behind the bar, which is
probably happiest throughout my growing up
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:through studying at the university and did
a 18-month employment with a commercial
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:business, which is fab, a lot of hard
work, understanding why that garage needed
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:a secretary, why the AI needed a...
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:account to pay that person in the team.
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:So he just kind of put the pieces together
in terms of what makes that business a
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:business.
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:So I didn't have that experience before.
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:So that was great.
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:Because my passion for hospitality, I love
it.
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:And seeing Chris is 30 months older, he
sort of thrives as a general manager.
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:I just thought, this is what I want to do.
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:I just want to be talking to people who
are more relatable to me, because of the
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:people that I've known, worked with,
friends.
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:This is one thing that I'm quite proud of
is I didn't have any candidates or any
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:clients.
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:But my contact was there, if that makes
sense, like in terms of one.
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:or two restaurants they weren't going to
do.
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:But they were just getting out and making
a game of it, suddenly recruiting in
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:Bristol.
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:So Birmingham and then at the South Coat,
it's kind of London and Hamlet for quite a
70
:while, really.
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:It was more the areas that hadn't been
covered by there's a lot of established
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:businesses at the time who had that.
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:So maybe I wasn't that clever because I
liked to be on the road for a couple of
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:hours and then the main people come back,
well I was in front of the candidates and
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:this is the job center.
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:They were putting the penny on marketing
for the first.
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:Yeah, because I didn't have any money.
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:I had a couple of grants to keep it going
for three months.
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:And that's why I just wanted to.
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:It sounds like you really jumped in just
head first.
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:Yeah.
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:And you just wanted to do it.
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:Yeah.
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:I had a friend, a friend actually that I
was talking to about it and she had a
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:small commercial, so I said, I'm thinking
about this.
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:And it changed in where I'm at the moment.
87
:It was the time to move on.
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:Expectations based on my time without a
resource.
89
:So it was why I got a bit of a telling
off, even though I massively delivered on
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:the financial figures and it was just the
app and the process behind it.
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:Whoa, I got told off a lot that time.
92
:You know, and it's sort of, hang on a
minute.
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:I've literally doubled the expectations of
people working shifts and, you know, hours
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:of hemp's working.
95
:And so I thought, no, I'm going to move
on.
96
:Speaking to a friend, I got a phone call
from one of her consultants who said, hey,
97
:here you're planning on setting up a
recruitment company.
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:I said, yeah, I need to get something in
the yellow pages today.
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:So I'm thinking something starting with A.
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:She said, yeah, I heard that.
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:What about appetite?
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:And I was just like, I was like,
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:Yeah.
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:Just, yeah.
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:So I popped down with a bunch of flowers
and a box of chocolates and a couple of
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:boards wide for the office.
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:Because it really meant something that
she'd actually thought, didn't really know
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:her, to phone up and say, what about that?
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:So that's pretty cool.
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:So I can't take credit for the name and
appetite across two businesses.
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:And I work in recruitment, the permanent
side, which is all about getting people,
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:just giving them the best experience,
understanding businesses, why they're the
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:best business for that candidate and
people.
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:So watching the team do it now to the same
standard with...
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:guys with a lot of experience or the guys
with no experience.
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:It's fantastic.
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:When Gem, who I worked with, joined at a
dark time of, she didn't know it was dark,
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:but I basically hit the recession, hadn't
reacted quickly enough to the staffing and
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:ended up, face to back once you, I'll
probably say, I just worked my way out of
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:it.
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:The question that Dad asked me was, was it
worth it?
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:It's like, yeah, because otherwise I'm
going to just destroy the brand forever
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:and my reputation.
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:And it's, you know, that's key.
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:They do a great job.
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:They do put the candle in first.
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:Yeah, over the pine
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:And that's really important because the
onboarding, when you join a new job, it's
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:the next step in your career in an
industry that's really under underrated in
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:terms of the respect levels.
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:And they do take pride in and get a buzz
as I did.
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:When you've got that kind of thing, it's
literally made their day.
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:And it's really cool to hear that.
134
:You know, so forget money, forget it's
about people.
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:Yeah, that will happen if you're good.
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:And the focus being the opposite from what
I saw in that brief stint in the previous
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:business to the way I see the guys
operating now.
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:It's
139
:is just get the people right, give the
right coaching, give the right amount of
140
:time to understand the business and to
understand the candidate.
141
:And so just to do a good job, and the buzz
at the end of it is, you know, you've made
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:someone's day, right?
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:What feels better than that?
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:And you talk about hospitality, friends
for life.
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:Yeah.
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:You know, you can see those relationships
happening on the supply side of the
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:recruiters and in the good businesses and
there's a few of them.
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:So yeah.
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:There's a golden thread with our guests
and it's very much that despite whatever
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:you've been through, ups and downs, it's
worth it.
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:I think everyone has said it's worth it.
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:Yeah.
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:I'm already passionate about industry.
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:Yeah, same thing.
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:Like there are just, there are some common
themes that just keep coming through.
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:And I don't know it's cause we're
attracted to the type of people cause
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:we're that is those type of people.
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:So I had this conversation with the Rain
Copes and then I had a BIHS app.
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:big case of hospitality and I know
Michelle, but yes, yeah.
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:Yeah.
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:Right.
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:And so, even when we meet the operas this
year, that was incredible because that was
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:all about people in our industry.
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:Everything that we try to do is make it
better for the people.
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:Yes.
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:Right.
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:So that when they come to our industry,
they've got jobs, they've got a profession
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:that we're all proud of.
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:Yes.
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:So we want them to see the fun side.
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:Of course you have to work, you have to
work in any job if you really want to get
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:somewhere and that's you're really lucky.
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:Right.
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:So to see that, it's a, it's a, I'm glad
you pulled that out because this is great
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:as well, because having been an recruiter
myself, I was always quite passionate.
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:And when my top team was called Learn,
Train, Recruit, that's what we did,
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:because we trained them up.
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:You know, before we put them into work, we
did like 10,000 people, we trained 10,000
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:people from scratch in six years.
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:So then when they came up, when they did
their first job, they had some skills set.
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:Right.
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:So that philosophy runs through, let's say
we're talking about hospitality as well,
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:which is why I was totally not doing it.
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:We have signed up to your mentors program.
185
:So because it's about helping people in
the industry, because whilst hopefully
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:I've got a lot more to give, there's, you
know, there's people that are coming
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:through that need to see what I want.
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:Yeah.
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:And it's so refreshing when you recruiters
talk about the industry here.
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:You know, they took my hospitality first
as opposed to the
191
:recruitment, which is when I think
recruitment and there are those
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:recruiters, I'm sure you know them, I know
them, they'll always be calling, but if
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:you can't look on that, they're literally
just to make money and just ask.
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:And it's a lot of patience for it.
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:It's about the people as well.
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:As you said before, it's meeting your
clients and your potential placements face
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:to face.
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:So it's not the opposite number.
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:You're not just trying to fill a seat,
you're just trying to get your money.
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:It's about people having it.
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:which makes an opportunity, which makes
the world a different place.
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:It's a massive connection.
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:And that's where, that's where in five
years time, that presence likely to be
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:client.
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:You know, it's seeing the CDPs go in and
become head chef and hey, I've been in a
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:sous chef sort of thing.
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:It's like good people are never quiet.
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:So, but it is, it is, I think it's been
the underdogs as well to them, isn't it?
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:Because if we look at the way that they're
reviewed, and I'm going to mention K's
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:name again, 165 billion turnover and
they're complaining to be recognised as an
211
:industry, I don't know, I don't know, I
don't know, I don't know.
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:It's the previous class system, the way
that parents and teachers view the
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:industry.
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:You know, I know you two have been into
the schools to encourage, and I love that.
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:I absolutely love that.
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:I'd love to get involved in that at some
point.
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:And the interesting bit that, you know,
spending time with the teachers and the
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:parents to feel proud about their kids
doing something that they would get at.
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:And you mentioned a competition between
schools and that's absolutely amazing
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:because kids are the bosses at the end of
the day, aren't they?
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:They're just influenced by other people to
get through that way as well as spending
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:time.
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:So I do love that.
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:I mean, certainly I've seen.
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:know, a few people that are, well, someone
very close to me that would do some
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:hospitality, brother actually, and you
know, a couple of the guys from school
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:like, what's going on?
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:It's like, hospitality, Bunningham
restaurant.
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:And it's just like, what?
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:That's real.
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:That's really, really real.
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:They don't know how hard this guy works
and what it's like doing a shift.
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:You should try because it's great fun.
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:Yeah, you might be frowned upon, but so
what?
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:Be the underdog.
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:And look at the case studies in the
industry and the encouragement of kids
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:coming into it.
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:They can be that person.
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:So, you know, I think we're...
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:We do know the challenges in the industry.
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:We know that there's a big burnout.
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:We know there's a drug and alcohol problem
and people taking the wrong coaching
243
:mechanisms, because I believe that that's
because it's easy.
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:You take the easy choice and you're in an
industry that's got alcohol everywhere,
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:but then it shows the whole world.
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:Right.
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:But what do we do with our managers?
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:Right.
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:What do we do with our, with our teams?
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:We reward them by giving them beer.
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:It's absolutely fine.
252
:But why?
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:Because that's also easy.
254
:So when it becomes case, someone is burnt
out or they've had something happen in
255
:their lives and.
256
:They turn to something.
257
:That's the reason that the drug and the
alcohol problem has become too much of a
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:coping mechanism to actually affect
people's lives.
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:And I think hospitality can't be solely
responsible for that, but it can think
260
:differently.
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:It can think differently.
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:Let's go paintballing.
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:Let's not say well done.
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:It's just being a little bit creative.
265
:I mean, hospitality is not the only
industry that's responsible for that.
266
:All businesses do it.
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:All industries do it.
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:It's those Christmas parties.
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:I'm doing exactly the same thing.
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:Let's go to a restaurant and we'll pant
some iron and drink beer.
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:But going back to the atria, Tim, as to
why that was such a good thing, you know,
272
:go to the industry events, there's nothing
wrong with celebrating the directors and
273
:the CEOs and the heads of, et cetera, et
cetera, but they're really doing quite
274
:well.
275
:Atollo is about a trapped retained
developer.
276
:Every business I'm involved in, Appetite
for recruitment and work, is a trapped
277
:retained developer.
278
:So, to mention the atria in a second, the
standard Appetite for work, when I got
279
:introduced to him, if you know my
gardener, you realize just quite how much
280
:of a legend he is, how good he is, how
strong he is, how dedicated he is.
281
:Part of that process and his team are, is
getting people into the shifts at Wembley,
282
:Twicken and Ascot, whatever that might be,
to earn some cash.
283
:I can't even remember when I was 14 years
old.
284
:Yeah.
285
:And he said, well, we don't probably need
to be able to serve alcohol.
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:Yeah, fine.
287
:But ultimately that first taste, if
they've got a great experience, they know
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:exactly where to go when they get there.
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:They're not getting lost.
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:They're not getting stressed.
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:If you're right, so you go in for those
doors, you turn left, you turn right.
292
:It's going to be a stand there.
293
:Paul's going to be on the stand and then
he's going to give you this.
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:You're going to come through.
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:See it already.
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:You're not stressed.
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:And that can be the first time they've
caught a pint.
298
:First time
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:clear the table, first thing they've
served the plate.
300
:And so to have the whole experience case
of, well, surely there's responsibility
301
:there because if they've had a really bad
experience, then they might not come back
302
:to the next shift or they might not in an
ideal world, which I know has happened to
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:a few people, falling in love with the job
and actually then taking it as a career.
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:And one of our key challenges is
attracting people.
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:So there's definitely a strong purpose
with Applite for Work.
306
:And then back to, we're going back and
forward, which I love.
307
:The Okras, it was Chris and Kieran's idea,
308
:predominantly college years background,
because Fletcher, Permanayam and Kieran
309
:and Bailey from Wagamomus and Hard Rock.
310
:They're both Hard Rock.
311
:Great guys.
312
:And with our other business partner, Ian.
313
:But I think the four of us, Ian Burke,
yourself, K2.com and various other things.
314
:So we're kind of a cool team, but you
can't think in the way that someone else
315
:does.
316
:So I know that we were four of us who sat
there and Kieran had come up with this
317
:idea with the Hard Rocks, which is
amazing.
318
:But it's actually, it's not that we didn't
talk about negatively, but it's actually
319
:about celebrating the real people.
320
:They had someone called Joan, 30 years in
Hard Rock, waitress.
321
:Fantastic with the team, fantastic with
the guests and completely underestimated
322
:by the snobs that hospitality is not a
career and all that kind of nonsense that
323
:Boris came out with back in the day.
324
:And then it's sort of to maintenance and
to support to bar the entry-level person
325
:and the reaction to getting that, so I
literally made that year, literally made
326
:that year rather than, you know what, the
CEO who's just got an award and gotten mad
327
:at tomorrow, it might appease his high
ego, you know, initially.
328
:Whereas...
329
:People have been sort of thrown around on
stage and just literally just like, yeah,
330
:this is what it's about.
331
:This is what it's about.
332
:Because actually the CEO doesn't need to
be, I'm not saying there's anything wrong
333
:with that, but my view is getting it in
the right order.
334
:And Chris McKeown kind of nailed that
because you're celebrating a CEO who's not
335
:going to be anywhere without Jones.
336
:And I mean, on the night of one of the
runners up, which was speaking to her
337
:before she went on, she was so excited.
338
:Oh really?
339
:And she came to see her.
340
:Oh, she didn't get the prize.
341
:And she was disappointed.
342
:But she turned to me and she just went,
I'll give it next year.
343
:Oh really?
344
:And I was like, yeah, that's a true bond.
345
:Right.
346
:I was like, this is it.
347
:This is it.
348
:Yeah.
349
:And it did create a lot of good will.
350
:It did.
351
:So far I've been in the room and like you
say, really appreciating it.
352
:Even being nominated, you know, and then
when it was enough for a lot of people.
353
:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
354
:Yeah, really, really good.
355
:First of its kind and certainly won't be
the last couple of things we tweak on in
356
:terms of the, but the first event of its
kind, you kind of, and thank you for a
357
:little bit of constructive feedback, but
actually on the most part, 95% it was
358
:pretty much on point.
359
:As you were building, did you have a
philosophy when you first started or a key
360
:principle when you first started that this
is what I'm going to be about?
361
:Or did you kind of do it and then it
developed over time?
362
:Oh, developed over time.
363
:So when I set up a type of recruitment, I
did think about doing the temp side
364
:because I'm going to Manchester and
having, you know, people working in the
365
:schools in the kitchen and first, my first
temp, Jack Makin's friends, stuff, I
366
:picked him up and took him to the school,
dropped him off and then came back because
367
:somebody didn't want me to transport.
368
:So I did think along the temping line.
369
:I never forgot about that because then I
just got, I'd never done permanent
370
:recruitment, never done hospitality
recruitment.
371
:That kind of compliance and said, this
was, let's just see what this is like.
372
:And then when I found permanent
recruitment.
373
:It's got to be a bit natural, hasn't it?
374
:Yeah.
375
:When I found permanent recruitment, it
was, I've done it before, not the
376
:post-partum recruitment, but the permanent
recruitment and it was just the case of
377
:kind of went completely that way.
378
:And I loved it.
379
:I loved finding out about the businesses
in a really intimate level and the
380
:operational structure, so it was the
reporting structure from the, for the MD
381
:to the regional director, to the area
managers and just having all that basic
382
:knowledge of, I'll bet it's the people,
it's an anagram of people, you know, so
383
:and it's really, really important.
384
:And then understanding what the features,
the benefits, the career planning and
385
:type of people that you're going to be
working with, people are working with, how
386
:do you describe your teams?
387
:How do you describe the company?
388
:All those kinds of things that you ask
those questions and the guys still do it
389
:today, and it's really, really important
and digging deep.
390
:That's just almost even not opening yet.
391
:Getting that understanding as to why, why
with this amazing candidate and why is
392
:this an amazing candidate?
393
:Why is this person worth employing?
394
:Because we all know it's like 16,000
pounds to train up.
395
:new manager.
396
:And then obviously look at the turnover of
staff so you can increase the retention of
397
:your teams, et cetera.
398
:So that person's got to be really, really
good to be worth, forget any fees attached
399
:to it, to be a given HR.
400
:So you've got to get to know them.
401
:That was my sole focus.
402
:I think to answer your question, no,
you've been completely apathetic from what
403
:I've got introduced to Mike.
404
:Yeah, that was in the back of my mind, but
it certainly was an opportunist.
405
:Actually, do you know what?
406
:Why don't we set up on the back of an
established and a tempting business?
407
:quite a nice experience.
408
:It comes from strength to strength.
409
:It's amazing.
410
:HGA was completely, completely fluke on
the back of meeting Jordan, who had that
411
:business, I don't know if we've talked
about this, to the point of throwing it
412
:back in the way, an amazing, lost their
way.
413
:They're then going into, with support, you
know, to the hospitality industry.
414
:And so, wow, I'm lucky to be introduced to
it at early days, really, really early
415
:days, and Jordan and I were paired up and
she had a job board and a recruitment
416
:agency, so sort of, actually we teamed up.
417
:Made the changes, put a lot of money into
a new website and all the systems were
418
:running behind it and spent time then
relaunched.
419
:But no, it was just coincidental that you
have a conversation that sort of makes
420
:sense and some of them, they're taller.
421
:I met Chris at an event, I think it was
when Haley was talking about delivering on
422
:the hospitality priority campaign and just
in passing, so Chris didn't know him.
423
:Said, hey, let's be in touch.
424
:Went to a couple of his events with
Kieran, the ESP, Rims 101.
425
:made a point of taking time to, I think
our first meeting was a beer and they were
426
:buzzing because I think they just
sponsored for something and the next one
427
:was a coffee.
428
:Let's talk, let's reduce the energy levels
and talk.
429
:I got a call from Chris one day saying,
this guy, James Lemon, has set up Let's
430
:Holo and he has approached me.
431
:Basically wanted to, his set up wasn't
right.
432
:So I thought to call you, then Ian,
myself, Chris and Kieran chatted.
433
:We'd already done a couple of sessions
with them just to help make sound in terms
434
:of, you know, ask those questions in terms
of where the business that we wanted to
435
:be.
436
:We already knew each other and then yeah,
it's a fairly tight window to take on
437
:Atolo.
438
:That was already set up.
439
:But when I read the Atolo, the reasoning
behind it, which is like, this is like
440
:looking in a mirror.
441
:You're talking, it's all the right things.
442
:It's about the mentoring and the
importance of how many people lived for so
443
:long without having a mentor.
444
:If there was just that time taken and
actually the industry culture, that's just
445
:one small aspect.
446
:It's about doing one small thing.
447
:that makes a significant difference.
448
:And that's what we believe in it.
449
:That's why you got involved.
450
:And then obviously the training aspects
and, and community is a plus and being
451
:able to do the operence.
452
:But the bottom line is actually with the
support, you know, the retention rates
453
:will, which is pushed off the scale in
hospitality can be reduced because people
454
:just need support.
455
:Good people need support.
456
:And we all do.
457
:I mean, I didn't have a mentor for way too
long.
458
:I was probably about 15 years too late,
which could have taken a lot of the pain
459
:and stress out of it.
460
:just to feel that bit of support and
completely isolated at times, it just all
461
:feels like it's against you.
462
:And that proactivity of competitors, et
cetera, it's going to sort of set a limb
463
:here and just doing the trial and error,
which is amazing because I think you have
464
:to have that drive, that energy.
465
:And actually that was a good question
before in terms of why, because I believe
466
:in this industry.
467
:I've seen people being broken by the
industry.
468
:I've seen people being discouraged in the
industry.
469
:Therefore, I'm very, very passionate about
it and to be able to do the cool stuff
470
:while being realistic.
471
:most tinted glasses and all that, but at
the same time, the clothes and the tinted,
472
:not completely blanked out.
473
:Yeah.
474
:So with a realistic approach, I think that
realistic approach is, yeah, let those
475
:things do the change and decisions people
are making.
476
:You know, as you talked about drugs and
alcohol and that easy support, which is
477
:the most even support, yeah, if abused.
478
:And, you know, we know it's right.
479
:And I didn't realize this is me just, I
was going into it.
480
:So I was going, but I was working with
someone, he decided to go back into
481
:industry, kept in touch, popped down and
he was telling me, this is, this is
482
:something that people will really resonate
with.
483
:I didn't realize that, you know, so many
businesses, we're going to talk about the
484
:potential of the market, it's going to be
real.
485
:You've been basically doing coke, having a
shot of tequila to get yourself through
486
:the shift.
487
:What do you do after the shift?
488
:Oh, well then you, then the party starts,
right?
489
:Okay.
490
:Then you feel pretty, and what if
something's going wrong in your life at
491
:that point?
492
:It might just be a party period of time
for a while, but what happens if you have
493
:a bereavement in the family?
494
:What happens if you have a relationship
break up?
495
:You know, at that point it becomes a case
of something that was fun becomes really
496
:something that's quite dark.
497
:And the balance is missed out on.
498
:So as I mentioned before, if companies can
not always be rewarding with alcohol, but
499
:they can be actually doing sort of fun
activities.
500
:The restaurant I was at, which is called
the Mississippi Exchange in Guildford,
501
:amazing American quality style.
502
:People dancing on the tables at Christmas
and stuff.
503
:We used to go play football.
504
:I wasn't a footballer, I'm a rugby player,
but I can, I know how to kick a football
505
:and to run around and so just get fun.
506
:We just play and then we had a competition
with another couple of the restaurants and
507
:doing all those kinds of things.
508
:And it's just.
509
:I mean, that's just one example.
510
:And I think sport is a really good
recreational activity.
511
:It would do, yeah, you know, it's nothing
wrong if you go and have a beer and get
512
:smashed over and over.
513
:I mean, there's not, I'm not a judge,
like, you know, but at the same time, I
514
:think we do have a responsibility to do
other things.
515
:So in those moments of doubts or
challenge, how do you stay focused,
516
:old-spyred?
517
:By reinventing a thing.
518
:I think having the next opportunity, one
thing, but then you can also get lost in
519
:that because hang on a minute, how do I
stay focused?
520
:Because I'm passionate.
521
:So to back off from everything after COVID
and it being, for so many reasons, a
522
:really difficult time, that then it's sort
of a case of, okay, right, so the next
523
:site of things starts, it's very, very
different with different energy, different
524
:personalities.
525
:the point of being lost.
526
:Yeah.
527
:And I was lost during the banking session.
528
:You can say, well, how the hell do I get
out of this?
529
:Or how do I get back into this?
530
:And in the case of, well, you just do, you
just do and try to be as kind and strong
531
:as possible, but I think that there's a
lot of leaders out there that probably,
532
:you know, it looks absolutely amazing
because there are certain times behind the
533
:scenes it's, it's an absolute, if I can
say shitshit and you, you kind of, you
534
:hide that, you put your front up there
and, and that's not actually healthy for a
535
:human being.
536
:So it's actually, you know, we work with
hospitality action.
537
:to be able to know everyone in the team.
538
:And obviously, you know, to phone up and
get those conversations, those supporters
539
:conversations, which is really, really
important.
540
:And I've got no embarrassment behind that
at all.
541
:In fact, you know, I think there are times
where there's just too much going on.
542
:So to keep that motivation and drive is
the case of, right, well then, okay, at
543
:that point, what gets me out of bed in the
morning?
544
:What I want to do.
545
:And actually I want to get out of bed in
the morning.
546
:If you'd asked me that question two months
ago, and I'm being really honest with you.
547
:All I'm going to do in my head, right, at
that time, all I'm doing in my head on
548
:certain days is thinking, shit, I've got
to do that, shit, I've got to do that.
549
:I've got to do that.
550
:And all those things that that's what you
get out of bed.
551
:You get out of bed to do those things
rather than sitting there thinking, you
552
:know, playing in your mind, then it
affects your sleep pattern.
553
:Sleep's really, really important.
554
:All of the things that happen.
555
:I mean, luckily I've got a strong enough
support network to be able to come through
556
:to the point of, right, here we go,
reinvention, the next stage, the next
557
:stage.
558
:And I'm really, really excited about it.
559
:Did I enjoy certain times of my career?
560
:No, no, no.
561
:But, I'm still here doing it.
562
:What key piece of advice would you offer
to aspiring leaguers in this society?
563
:Oh, good question.
564
:Okay.
565
:I'm going to go with, I'm going to go with
two words twice.
566
:Confidence and humility.
567
:I think getting that balance right, you
don't be overconfident and then, and then
568
:two, not, not humble enough, because I
think that's really, really key to be real
569
:and a good human being on that side.
570
:And if your confidence is taking a nobble,
which it will.
571
:not, which it will with all of us.
572
:And I think that the character bit is
being able to come through that on the
573
:other side.
574
:Then I think the humility goes to an
unequal level of over compensation, which
575
:isn't good.
576
:And I think then the vulnerability and
bravery are the other two words I'd use.
577
:And that might not make sense, I'll
explain.
578
:The vulnerability is absolutely key,
right?
579
:So we're human beings.
580
:And I think showing that vulnerability,
genuine vulnerability...
581
:not in a way that's going to concern
people, but in a way that is a case of
582
:it's okay to be a human being.
583
:So forget all the other words from the
past, it's okay not to be okay.
584
:I think it's okay to be a human being.
585
:And I think that for a leader is a lot
more engaging than a fake facade, which is
586
:a case of, what's wrong with, I'm not in
that relationship, I don't quite know what
587
:it is.
588
:I think because the vulnerability is not
there sometimes.
589
:And the other word that I used at that
time is fearlessness.
590
:So fearlessness is basically bravery.
591
:To show that vulnerability, I believe is
592
:But it's also then combines with the
confidence to be able to say, I've got
593
:you.
594
:Yeah.
595
:I've got my role locked in to be
approachable.
596
:And, you know, we've said before, it's,
you know, leaders are everywhere.
597
:Yeah.
598
:If it's a case of, you know, you're
working a long shift and people are
599
:lagging in that energy you bring to pull
people up, that's, that's real leadership.
600
:You know, more so than it is to sit in the
boardroom.
601
:This is where you'll be quite authentic
because my first impression of you was, I
602
:knew you were a busy piece.
603
:Yes.
604
:And it was Vicky, Vicky came over, Vicky
Glover.
605
:She came over and she was like, Nick,
what's the, if it's all right, if you
606
:could speak with you.
607
:And I was like, why, why is he asking, you
know, I was like, of course you can, if I
608
:read some of your stuff anyway.
609
:I didn't know she'd said that.
610
:Yeah.
611
:I was like, anyway, and then when I went
over to you, of course you, you know, you
612
:can't, you're paying for the event
essentially.
613
:And then it was like,
614
:Yeah, but yet you're a podcast writer.
615
:And it was just so hungry.
616
:It was just like, so funny because like
talking a lot of times is growing massive,
617
:like literally just been since then, but
we were kind of like just feeling away and
618
:what we wanted to come at that point, but
for you to do that with such deference is
619
:quite rare, particularly in recruitment, I
would say.
620
:So I was quite taken aback by it in a
really positive way.
621
:I was like, I was trying to go, of course
this is all right.
622
:Like that shows you took your talk.
623
:Because you would just, you know, think,
just assume like we get now at sometimes
624
:where people just come up to us because
they, we're not celebrities, but they sort
625
:of think we are in their head.
626
:And they'll just come up to us like quite
rudely sometimes, just expecting us to be
627
:available for learning.
628
:Whereas it, so it was quite, to see that
was quite a, quite a comparison.
629
:So.
630
:The bit of the story that Tim is missing
out, because he did recite this story to
631
:Hades, I know all about this story.
632
:The bit he's missing out is the fact that
at the same time where you were asking me
633
:if you could speak with him.
634
:In his mind, it's like, but you're Nick.
635
:Yeah, yeah.
636
:You're Nick and you've done this, this and
this.
637
:So it was almost double-edged sword and
you both didn't realize you were feeling
638
:the same.
639
:Didn't realize that would make quite the
impact.
640
:And I think he's really sweet to kind of
hook us up as it were.
641
:And actually, I think that being a bit
unassuming is quite important, I think,
642
:for a leader.
643
:And I'm not putting myself as a leader.
644
:I don't feel like a leader.
645
:But I think that if I was to look at
leaders that I know, the strongest leaders
646
:are unassuming sometimes, yeah, rather
than...
647
:I'd say you're a leader, personally,
but...
648
:So that sound Nick, just in case you want
to drink, I'm sure you will.
649
:It means it's time for a rapid fire
question round.
650
:Put the cuppa down for the rest of the
time.
651
:Why am I not scared?
652
:You should be actually.
653
:Is it a bit?
654
:A little bit serious.
655
:Or not?
656
:We've explored your professional insights,
but now it's time to delve into the real
657
:Nick.
658
:To our regular listeners, you know the
rules, but if you're new and Nick, your
659
:challenge is to answer each question with
just one word.
660
:Or not.
661
:I don't think I've ever answered a
question with one word in my life.
662
:I do want to finish.
663
:Because I like you both.
664
:You have recruited me.
665
:Awesome.
666
:Right.
667
:Okay.
668
:We understand it's a tool order for those
in the hospital as well, particularly
669
:recruiters to keep it concise, but let's
see how you fare.
670
:We're judging on speed, weight and
succinctness, which I hope you can prove
671
:better than I can say.
672
:The one who's on top of the leaderboard at
the end of the season will receive...
673
:Are you ready for this, Nick?
674
:Yes.
675
:A...
676
:Amazon.
677
:Right.
678
:It don't care, it's the competition I just
did.
679
:Reward is irrelevant.
680
:Yes.
681
:So you geared up.
682
:Um, I'm going to, yes, I'm ready.
683
:I'm ready.
684
:Go.
685
:Okay.
686
:Let's get some answers.
687
:Zombie apocalypse, run, hide or join?
688
:Join.
689
:Airworm song.
690
:No.
691
:Super power choice, flight or
invisibility?
692
:Flight.
693
:Strangest spoon you've ever tried?
694
:Caterpillar.
695
:If you were a cocktail, which one would
you be?
696
:An old fashioned.
697
:Favorite word in the English language?
698
:Hospitality.
699
:Oh, that's good.
700
:That's good.
701
:If you could be any historical figure for
the day, who would you be?
702
:Winston Churchill.
703
:Which house or Hogwarts would you be?
704
:Never seen.
705
:Most unusual item in your home?
706
:A wok.
707
:If you had to yelp, what would you name
it?
708
:Appetite for adventure.
709
:Oh, I learned.
710
:Favourite sitcom character?
711
:Chandler.
712
:Best dish you could cook?
713
:Stove-Rite.
714
:If you could ban just one food forever,
what would it be?
715
:Mushy Bees.
716
:What was the last thing that made you
laugh out loud?
717
:This.
718
:Brilliant, we love that.
719
:Queen first or jam on a spoon?
720
:Oh jam.
721
:My mate, love it or hate it?
722
:Love it.
723
:Most unexpected hobby?
724
:Walking.
725
:That is unexplainable.
726
:If you could teleport anywhere right now,
where would you be?
727
:Australia.
728
:Favorite snack?
729
:Chocolate.
730
:If you could have the dinner with any
fictional character, who would that be?
731
:It would be Jack Nicholson from One Flew
Over the Cuckoo's Nest.
732
:Nick, why do round pizzas come in square
boxes?
733
:No idea.
734
:What do you call a boomerang that won't
come back?
735
:A ruler.
736
:Why don't you call a crocodile in a vest?
737
:Lost.
738
:The answer is of course an investigator.
739
:Oh dear.
740
:And the other one was a steed, but we
wouldn't take Runa.
741
:We wouldn't take Runa.
742
:That was good.
743
:Remember old schools that obviously we
wouldn't Runa anyway.
744
:Yeah.
745
:Thanks, Snags.
746
:Great to have you on now actually to get
some insight on who Nick Cloamer is behind
747
:all the bright lights.
748
:It's lovely to meet you.
749
:Yeah.
750
:No thank you.
751
:It's very kind.
752
:And this is the first podcast I've ever
done.
753
:Ever, ever, ever.
754
:So you know what?
755
:I really enjoyed it.
756
:I think you guys are great individually
and collectively and I can't wait to do
757
:more stuff with you in terms of, you know,
positive industry things to do our best.
758
:Yeah.
759
:Hats off, hats off.
760
:Exactly.
761
:Big lever in your message.
762
:Better together.
763
:Always.
764
:Thank you, Nick.
765
:Okay.
766
:Thank you.
767
:And thank you to our listeners for tuning
in to Talking Hospitality.
768
:Don't forget, you can get in contact with
us via our website, www.
769
:You can also contact us through socials on
Instagram, Facebook and TikTok by
770
:searching at Talking Hospitality.
771
:Our website offers more episodes, blogs on
the topics discussed and training that are
772
:specific to the hospitality industry to
help you and your team develop their
773
:hospitality careers.
774
:Your support makes these conversations
possible.
775
:Remember to like and subscribe wherever
you get your podcasts.
776
:Stay tuned for more engaging discussions
in the world of hospitality.
777
:Until next time, keep pushing boundaries
and stay awesome.